*sigh*
man, i swear, people just can't take the truth sometimes...
some Anonymous Coward reverted the edits on the mix of the language with turkish and slavic. i'm gonna revert them back. *sigh* Project2501a 19:40, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
«Μπογιάτισα το ντουβάρι και το ταβάνι με μπογιά». Count the greek words in this phrase. LOL Etz Haim 18:58, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- Four. I don't speak Modern Greek (I studied some Ancient Greek when I was doing Indo-European), but given boya Turkish 'paint', duvar Turkish 'door', tavan Turkish 'ceiling' I would guess that this sentence means "Paint the door and the ceiling with paint". Some people don't understand that all languages borrow words from other languages, and, indeed, that doing so is a sign of strength and vitality. Evertype 20:00, 2005 Jan 4 (UTC)
- Correct, congratulations! In modern "demotic" greek, which has had many influences from "katarevousa", you can say the same thing with 100% Greek words: «Έβαψα τον τοίχο και την οροφή με βαφή». However, people tend to use words from both Greek and non-Greek origin indiscriminatively in their conversations, so you may encounter combinations of the above. Etz Haim 23:54, 4 Jan 2005 (UTC)
Sorry my friend, but gathering all the word loans you can find and putting them to a phrase to prove the influence of a language upon the other is a bit dubious and not so sincere. The phrase you have created would hardly possibly come out of the mouth of a speaker of greek, as it sounds too "vulgar" and unnatural to be true! Being a greek speaker i have to say that though those words exist in greek their use is not as common as the equivalent greek ones as "τοίχος" "έβαψα" etc. That phrase seems totally unnatural to my ears! NOt to mention that those words you refer to are not used in all parts of greece. Loan words are very often, and greek has turkish words, especially in places like my birthplace were the turkish population before 1913 was of the same number as the greek.
OK, this article needs some heavy editing.
It's small and there's a bunch of conflicting versions of it to the point, imnsho, that ti can't be saved. i propose we, the greek wikipedians, either work on it and improve it, or just scrap it and include a "modern greek" section in the Greek language article.
now, how do i put that to a vote? Project2501a 22:58, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)
- I would suggest writing it up in the main article. If it gets really long it could be made into a new article of its own in due course. I do suggest giving concrete examples of borrowings of loanwords. Atkinson pointed out that the interrogative particle mi is a Turkish borrowing for instance. Evertype 20:00, 2005 Jan 4 (UTC)
- Unfortunately the main Greek language article is now getting a bit long. I think it would be better ideally to improve this Modertn Greek article, and maybe move here some of the main article (for instance the lists of phrases). I'd also really like to see some more linguistic stuff on the Demotic/Katharevousa question, not just the history and politics, but how one can tell the one from the other. rossb 07:29, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)
yeah, true, i should improve this article. just been busy irl lately. i'll eventually get around to it. hmm. now, where can i find a greek linguist...
Project2501a 08:24, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)
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